I believe that religions, all religions, are founded on faith (belief without evidence) and superstition. Anyone who has read the Bible and/or Koran with an open mind can attest to this, as these so-called “holy books” contain about as much truth as the Looney Tunes cartoons, with characters such as Bugs, Bunny, Elmer Fudd, Sylvester the Cat, Tweetie Bird, etc. Yet nevertheless, the world’s three main monotheistic religions, Christianity, Islam and Judaism, have at least withstood the test of time and are part of the “fabric” of societies across the globe; for better or for worse (albeit mostly worse) in my opinion.
Then we have what I consider to be three of the most popular religious cults in the United States, whose followers are not simply ignorant, but complete idiots. These are Mormons, Jehovah’s Witnesses and Scientologists. It is difficult for me to discern which of the adherents of these cults are the bigger morons as all three groups are comprised of needy individuals with a low IQ, and all possess a complete lack of reason and common sense; except for their leaders of course, who are raking in truckloads of money.
I’ve read most of the Bible, a good deal of the Koran and much of the gibberish distributed by Jehovah’s Witnesses. But I must admit I’ve never even looked at the Book of Mormon or Dianetics. I suppose (maybe incorrectly so) that the Book of Mormon simply borrows from the Bible and Koran, while adding from the imagination of Joseph Smith Jr.; its founder. Dianetics was written by science fiction writer L. Ron Hubbard, which basically says all one needs to know about the validity of this quackery.
Anyway, I digress. This article deals exclusively with the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, which is also a corporation, a business, as all religions are. To the members of this church, as well as all others, I will make this public service announcement: OPEN YOUR MINDS and CLOSE YOUR POCKETBOOKS. TGO
Refer to story below. Source: Associated Press
SALT LAKE CITY – Jailed polygamous sect leader Warren Jeffs may no longer have control of his southern Utah-based church after a senior leader on Monday moved to replace him.
William E. Jessop filed papers with the Utah Department of Commerce to take over as president of the corporation that is the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.
Jessop, who served as bishop of the twin FLDS border towns of Hildale, Utah, and Colorado City, Ariz., said Monday his rise to the presidency is not an attempt to take over the church, but rather the fulfillment of an earlier directive from Jeffs.
“It is an attempt to preserve … the church,” Jessop, 41, said in an interview with The Associated Press.
It remained unclear whether Jeffs would immediately lose all power in the church or share it with Jessop, at least for now.
Jeffs has not filed papers with the state indicating he had plans to resign. However, he would not have to formally step down as the church’s president for Jessop to be installed, Commerce Department spokeswoman Jennifer Bolton said Monday.
An attempt to reach Jeffs at the Texas jail where is being held was unsuccessful Monday, and a telephone call to his criminal attorney was not immediately returned. A message left for Rod Parker, a Salt Lake City attorney who represents the church in civil matters, also wasn’t returned.
Jeffs, 55, was convicted in Utah in 2007 on two felony counts of rape as an accomplice and was ordered to serve life sentences, but the convictions were later overturned.
Earlier that year, while jailed and awaiting trial, Jeffs tried to cede authority of the church — both as president and spiritual leader — to Jessop in a series of recorded telephone calls to followers and to Jessop, himself.
“I know of your ordination, that you are the key holder, and I have sent a note with my signature so that there is no question,” Jeffs told Jessop in a Jan. 24, 2007, telephone call from a Utah jail.
The tapes and a DVD of the conversations were released by the court as part of Jeffs’ trial.
Jessop did not respond to the offer at the time, and Jeffs publicly remained spiritual head and president of the church. Other church members speculated the calls from Jeffs were merely a test of their faith.
Four days later, Jeffs attempted suicide by trying to hang himself in the jail.
Then in December 2007, after his Utah conviction, Jeffs resigned as president of the church corporation, believing he could no longer run its day-to-day business from behind bars. But he remained the group’s spiritual leader.
Jeffs was later moved to a jail in Texas, where he is awaiting trial on bigamy and aggravated sexual assault charges. Last month, he retook control of the church following the abrupt resignation of his replacement, who was forced out of the church.
Jessop said he is only stepping forward now because he believes he can help provide the church with the leadership it needs while Jeffs is incarcerated.
“We take things at Heavenly Father’s pace,” said Jessop, who listed a Colorado address on the Commerce Department paperwork.
Jessop’s assertion of leadership is largely unprecedented, and it wasn’t immediately clear whether the move would fracture or unite the 10,000-strong church with members in Arizona, British Columbia, Colorado, South Dakota, Texas and Utah.
Asked if he is now considered the church’s prophet and spiritual leader, Jessop said that will be up to individual church members. In the past, the church president has also been considered its prophet.
Meanwhile, a trial for Jeffs is set for later this year in Texas, where prosecutors allege he had sex with two girls, one under age 14 and one under age 17. A court has entered not guilty pleas on Jeffs’ behalf.
Canadian authorities also are investigating allegations that in 2005 Jeffs married two 12-year-old sect girls who were brought from a church enclave in British Columbia to the U.S. It’s not clear whether those girls are the same victims whose relationships with Jeffs are the basis for the Texas charges.
Jeffs assumed the role as FLDS prophet and president in September 2002 following the death of his father, Rulon Jeffs, who suffered a series of strokes.
His rise to power has been questioned by former church members who say there was no succession plan in place when the elder Jeffs died because he had preached that the second coming of Jesus Christ was imminent, and therefore no one would need to lead the church in the future.
The FLDS practices polygamy in marriages arranged through church leaders. Historically some unions have involved underage girls, although following a 2008 raid on the church’s Eldorado, Texas ranch, a church spokesman said the faith had halted the practice.
The faith’s religious roots are tied to the early teachings of Joseph Smith who founded the mainstream Mormon church. Smith’s church abandoned the practice of plural marriage in 1890 as a condition of Utah’s push for statehood and excommunicates members found practicing it.
TGO – thank you for your reply. You assume theology is the same as astrology. If you refer to worldly religions, then I agree with you. However, I was talking about the Theology of the Bible. Religion of the Bible is unique in every respect! It is given from the Creator and gradually revealed from few laws given to Adam and Eve (Genesis 1:28; Genesis 2:17) and enlarged all the way to the nation of Israel only. Then it is perfected by Jesus Christ and aplied to all mankind. Theology of the Bible does not deal with doctrines only. It studies also archeology and biblical languages. And although Bible is not a scientific book, but whenever it touches on scientific topics is absolutely true!
TGO – “God works in mysterious ways” is a cliche of those who do not understand God and Bible. Now I like to use the same wise principle of Jesus Christ when he said “Out of your own mouth I judge you…” in Luke 19:22. and this in regard to your comment, particlularly, I cite: ‘I really don’t know how you or anyone else can pretend to know what Jesus meant when he said anything, or whether he even said what it is claimed he said?’ Because you seem to know (or at least you pretend to know) almost everything about Biblie and God…In the information you say about yourself: I love science…well, theology is a science, so don’t you have respect for this science or you just choose yourself which science to respect?
Yes, I know the term is a cliché. It’s often used by religious people when they reach a dead end in trying to defend an argument which they cannot defend. I was being sarcastic when I made reference to it.
Theology is a science in the same way that astrology is a science; which basically means it isn’t a science at all. Theology deals with studying and acquiring an understanding of religious tradition. Science, as I’m sure you know, has nothing to do with tradition. For example, a theologian may study the history of Islam by reading the Koran (Quran) and be able to determine how/why Muslim women wear burqas or why Muslim men are allowed multiple wives. Yet neither of these “issues” is scientific in nature. One cannot compare this type of study with astronomy, physics, biology, chemistry, cosmology, etc.
I do respect the study of theology as it helps us to understand the social structure of people at various times throughout history and in different parts of the globe. It provides a backdrop as to why Christianity took root for example and why Paganism failed. It helps in understanding the basic difference between monotheistic and polytheistic beliefs, such as that of the Hindus for instance. In this type of realm theology is extremely valuable. However, being that it is not a true science, it cannot help us determine, through the scientific method of experimentation, whether the thousand Hindu gods are real, whether Allah rose to heaven on a horse, whether Jesus was born of a Virgin, etc. These things are based, to a great extent, on demographics. A child born in Calcutta, India is more likely to be a Hindu than one born in Mobile, Alabama or Little Rock, Arkansas; just as a child born in Tel Aviv, Israel is more likely to be Jew than one born in Tehran, Iran. This is where tradition comes in. People generally accept the religious faith (tradition) of their ancestors; that which they were taught to believe. Of course, there are always exceptions, but for the most part, people tend to adhere to tradition. And this is especially true in religious societies such as those found in the Middle East, parts of the Far East and the South (United States).
TGO – May I? Just a short comment on your comment. On what you said at the end, I cite:”Bible simply won’t do. It’s all foolish nonsense, superstition and fairy tale.” If that is so, then how did the ‘First Council of Nicaea (A.D. 325)’ “invent” the “Holy Trinity”? Isn’t that then also a “foolish nonsense, superstition and fairy tale”? By the way I do not believe in trinity, since it is a pagan teaching of all religions except the one in the Bible. When Jesus say in the Bible “I and the Father are one”, he is simply saying the he is always in harmony with his Father. In other places he says “Father is greater than I”.
You can comment all you like. I welcome people’s opinions.
The First Council of Nicaea, according to history, was convened by Constantine in order to establish a general consensus among Christians regarding several issues, one of them being the relationship between God (the father) Jesus (the son) and the ghost (Holy Spirit). This is where it was first decided that all three were now one; the Trinity. And yes, of course it’s foolish nonsense, superstition and fairy tale. The whole thing was an invention, as was most everything in the Bible – from Genesis to Revelation.
I really don’t know how you or anyone else can pretend to know what Jesus meant when he said anything, or whether he even said what it is claimed he said?
Don’t you find it curious that God presumably sent Jesus to be sacrificed when he did. I mean really, had he waited a couple of thousand more years when we had radio, television, the internet, etc. it would have been so much more enlightening for the masses. Just imagine, the entire world could have watched as Jesus walked on water, brought dead people back to life, and more importantly witnessed his own resurrection. Yet instead, he presented his only begotten son to the world in a desert sparsely populated by nomadic barbarians without so much as a common language. I know, I know; God works in mysterious ways.
GhostRider – Love and Peace to you too. Please, let me comment on your comment, particularly the part, where it says, I cite: “God obviously matured and became a much more compassionate and loving intelligent being…” The Truth is, God, the Creator and Soveriegn of all the universe he created, need not “mature” because he alone is absolutely wise – Mark 10:18. On the other hand, his son, Jesus Christ needed to “mature” – Hebrews 2:10. Until we both agree on this at least one point, our conversation might turn out to be purely philosophical.
Mama Mia…! This is way too much for me to “delve” into at the moment; although quite amateurish I must say.
I just went through a minor dissertation in my response to Phillip Nicewaner on another one of my posts… He does more than merely recite the Bible (which proves nothing, really). He at the very least presents philosophical arguments for the existence of God (although refutable). Nevertheless, they require clear thinking and knowledge of philosophical concepts; not just merely nonsensical gibberish.
But… God, if such an entity did in fact exist, did not need to mature, for the God of the Gospels is the perfect being. Jesus Christ, son of God, and one with Him as part of the “Holy Trinity,” is also perfect; remember: the Father, the Son and Holy Spirit make up ONE.
This is what was laid out in the First Council of Nicaea (A.D. 325) when the “Holy Trinity” was invented.
For those of you who want to (actually) learn more on this, I suggest further reading – however, the Bible simply won’t do. It’s all foolish nonsense, superstition and fairy tale.
Theologian1… I’d like to comment on the article from the point of view of your comment and what it tells me about the intelligent being that has come to be known as God. Actually. what it tells me about Him back in the Genesis time period which took place quite some time before the birth of Jesus to Mary, a very human homo sapien, and during which time span, God obviously matured and became a much more compassionate and loving intelligent being, much like the growth we ourselves are blessed enough to experience in our own development – remember, we are made in His image.
And the Lord God said, “The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and
eat, and live forever.” (Genesis 3:22)
Creating life is the only thing He could mean by, “becoming one of us”, because prior to that, the Bible doesn’t talk about any other accomplishments. Not that we are all that close but with all that knowledge that we have attained, scientifically , we are on the path of one day possibly creating “Life”. (…becoming like one of them?)
As parents there are many experiences, experiences that we ourselves may have chosen, that we may not necessarily want our children to experience, but as they grow up, acquire knowledge similarly or greater than ours, and become one of us, how and why would we judge them negatively? That Adam or Eve could eat of the tree of life only becomes a concern to God after they have consumed fruit from the tree of knowledge which brings up his selfishness back then. Hey, who of us has not shown incredible selfishness at times during our development and have seen it replaced by love and compassion (we were made in his image).
Theologian1, both you and TGO have knowledge of good and evil and as far as I can see, neither are using it for evil so in the sense of morality, it isn’t immoral for neither of you, nor God, to process it.
Love and Peace
I like to comment on the article from the point of view of your ‘weekly thought’ and I cite this part: “Not by accident does Genesis 3 make the father of knowledge a serpent – slimy, sneaking and abominable.” I wonder if you have not yet realised that your ‘knowledge’ that you use in your reasonings, especially when it comes to expessing your views on the Bible, falls into the same category?